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Post by JMMREVIEW on Aug 4, 2014 17:10:49 GMT -5
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Post by JMMREVIEW on Aug 5, 2014 3:32:38 GMT -5
0:13 Really? I think it's one of the most fun games ever, as well as one of the most rewarding. 1:25 I don't think escapism is a major reason for gaming. At least for most. 3:30 DkS has one of the grandest stories in all of gaming. But it's a constructivist narrative. If you don't look, you won't find. I think it's ideal for storytelling. ^^ I am going to reply on here, mostly because I dont like youtubes comment section. 0:13 Fun and rewarding are very different things, sure a game can be fun and rewarding but I stand by what I said Dark Souls is not one of them. Tony Hawks, Mario 64, Angry Birds, Star Fox 64 and Banjo Kazooie are games I would consider fun. Dark Souls, Resident Evil Code Veronica X (any true survival horror) and Left 4 Dead are stressful games to play but are highly rewarding. The greater the challenge the greater the reward. 3:30 I would say this is an overstatement, it serves a purpose and sets the scene I wouldn't say it was ground breaking or anything. Like I said in the video I am glad you don't have to follow it but its there if you really need it. This is completely down to personal taste on my part I have said it before and I will say it again if you want a good story watch a movie.
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Silent Sputnik
A Hind D!?
Posts: 568
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Post by Silent Sputnik on Aug 5, 2014 3:48:37 GMT -5
Check this out. It's how I started paying attention to the story in the first place.
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Silent Sputnik
A Hind D!?
Posts: 568
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Favorite Game: Warcraft III
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Post by Silent Sputnik on Aug 5, 2014 3:51:35 GMT -5
I wouldn't say that DkS has "chosen one" syndrome. Everyone doubts that you're anything special until you ring the bells and get the lordvessel.
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Post by Blade Runner 07 on Aug 21, 2014 16:21:22 GMT -5
1. I do think story is very important in any game. Sometimes a game with mediocre gameplay can keep you engaged by its story like the way Sonic Adventure 2 did for me. Tony Hawks Pro Skater (1-3) on the other hand is 100% gameplay and that works too. By the fifth game in the series they introduced a story driven single-player. It worked because it was so different but tethered to the principles of skate culture.
2. As for being "The Chosen One". I couldn't agree with you more on just how old that is getting. Calling back to games like Resident Evil, you always played as an average Joe with one element (combat training) helping you through the situation... and that works.
Ive noticed that many games take after the Reloaded Neo as opposed to The Matrix Neo and THATS what made the first matrix movie such a good story. Neo wasn't the chosen one for 99% of the film. He was an average Joe who's computer hacking put him into his situation and he was confused and vulnerable most of the film. By the end it's finally revealed to the audience that he IS the chosen one and the film ends. THAT WORKS!
Most games today compress the first films stage into the first 10 minutes of the games and spread the other two films over the course of a trilogy.
Thanks for the shout out JMM. Looking back, I kinda hijacked that GTAV thread with that opinion. I really wanted to drive the point home.
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Silent Sputnik
A Hind D!?
Posts: 568
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Post by Silent Sputnik on Aug 21, 2014 17:36:40 GMT -5
1. I do think story is very important in any game. Sometimes a game with mediocre gameplay can keep you engaged by its story like the way Sonic Adventure 2 did for me. I know I disagree with you a lot, but you think SA2 had a good story!?! !! The main stories strike me as utterly absurd and purposeless. And the final story where both the good guys and the bad guys work together makes me feel like the "moral" of the story is for children. It makes me throw up a little, honestly. And the super-saiyan whatever that happens at the end... I don't even.. Ive noticed that many games take after the Reloaded Neo as opposed to The Matrix Neo and THATS what made the first matrix movie such a good story. Neo wasn't the chosen one for 99% of the film. He was an average Joe who's computer hacking put him into his situation and he was confused and vulnerable most of the film. Just like in Dark Souls, basically. You become "The Chosen One" when you've completed around half of the game. And even after that point, you're still only a few frames away from death at any time. I think the whole story is centered on hopelessness, fragility, and perseverance rather than the inevitability of victory. Though in more general terms for other games, I agree.
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Post by Blade Runner 07 on Aug 21, 2014 17:52:31 GMT -5
I can't argue with the soniC point. You are right. My 13 year-old self had to see it through to the end though and that's the difference. Social interaction and story are the two things that drive me in games. Great gameplay can only go so far. See Call of Duty for that. If all my friends are buying MW3, I might buy it too. If I start to care about what happens to the characters in the story, that will tempt me to buy the next installment.
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Xargen
Metal Gear
Kickin' names, taking ass.
Posts: 1,651
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Post by Xargen on Aug 21, 2014 20:08:26 GMT -5
TBH I'd still go back and play through Sonic Adventure 2... I have no idea how they can get the controls for that game pretty much spot on, but any following Sonic games it's like "lulwut? wut way do u wnt me 2 go?" all while I'm foaming at the mouth 'cus I'm holding up and he's running in circles or some shit
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Post by JMMREVIEW on Aug 22, 2014 2:27:23 GMT -5
Great gameplay can only go so far. This statement worries me, it worries me in case a game developer reads it and decides to spend less time and money on gameplay and more on story. If I had it my way this statement would read "Great gameplay can get you everywhere" I am going to share a personal experience that I think some of you should relate to. "When I was a little boy" I played a game called goldeneye 007 on my Nintendo 64, I had never seen the movie Goldeneye and as a consequence I had no idea what was going on. I didn’t read the file before the level started, all I knew was I had to pick something up, plant a bug or shoot something in every level. There was no narrative or consistency to me, I would suddenly have to replay a level I already played before and the end of the game randomly jump to an Aztec space shuttle level then to a level set in Egypt. Did any of this matter? NO the gameplay more that made up for the story, or lack of story.
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Silent Sputnik
A Hind D!?
Posts: 568
Now Playing: Rocket League
Favorite Game: Warcraft III
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Post by Silent Sputnik on Aug 22, 2014 3:40:37 GMT -5
Social interaction and story are the two things that drive me in games. Great gameplay can only go so far. See Call of Duty for that. If all my friends are buying MW3, I might buy it too. ^ Well Blade is saying that for him, great gameplay can only go so far towards his personal enjoyment. Fair enough. I was guilty of buying mw2, blops, and mw3 solely due to having all of my friends abandon me in favour of those games. If I start to care about what happens to the characters in the story, that will tempt me to buy the next installment. I could see me temping me if the story was great and the gameplay was at the very least acceptable. But neither have been true in any CoD game in my opinion. (Except for CoD4's gameplay)
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Post by Blade Runner 07 on Aug 22, 2014 4:19:48 GMT -5
Great gameplay can only go so far. This statement worries me, it worries me in case a game developer reads it and decides to spend less time and money on gameplay and more on story. If I had it my way this statement would read "Great gameplay can get you everywhere" I am going to share a personal experience that I think some of you should relate to. "When I was a little boy" I played a game called goldeneye 007 on my Nintendo 64, I had never seen the movie Goldeneye and as a consequence I had no idea what was going on. I didn’t read the file before the level started, all I knew was I had to pick something up, plant a bug or shoot something in every level. There was no narrative or consistency to me, I would suddenly have to replay a level I already played before and the end of the game randomly jump to an Aztec space shuttle level then to a level set in Egypt. Did any of this matter? NO the gameplay more that made up for the story, or lack of story. Well the flip-side is ALL story and no gameplay like in The Walking Dead. Just saying. That works too. If a developer saw my comment they would have to eventually realize that you need a solid foundation (gameplay) to build a great story on. Story's are personal, while gameplay (as in Goldeneye) is that secret sauce that gets you hooked. Could Goldeneye have stood on it's own without a story? Absolutely. Does that mean I wish it had come without one? Absolutely not. Goldeneye had its hooks in deep before I had ever seen a James Bond film and I had completed the entire game before had read a single word of the dossier and before even seeing a trailer for the film it was based on. All I had was box art, and the intro video. Once I got a bit older and took time to read the dossier, I really appreciated it. I'm all for story as long as it doesn't get in the way of awesome gameplay. I mean, would Bond ever duel wield RCP-90s? No way right? That's the difference. Story often either limits the gameplay or vice versa and that's a problem.
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Post by JMMREVIEW on Aug 22, 2014 10:11:20 GMT -5
Well the flip-side is ALL story and no gameplay like in The Walking Dead. Just saying. That works too. I argued in one of my video that it doesn't work, in fact I said it wasnt even a game, more of an interactive movie. Story often either limits the gameplay or vice versa and that's a problem. This is the big problem IMO, I hate the thought of a game developer limiting the gameplay because of the story, I couldn't care less about gameplay limiting story. I also hate when gameplay is limited by logic "you can only carry two guns in real life so you can only carry two guns in this game" this is a game not real life!
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Post by Blade Runner 07 on Aug 22, 2014 16:10:19 GMT -5
I would high five you right now if I could. Ill stand by what I said about story being important but some of the best games forsake realism for fun. To elaborate on what I said above...
In what way is Goldeneye a James Bond sim? You can carry twice your weight in weapons and gadgets, you mercilessly gun down hundreds of guards, a pistol is usually as useful as the power weapons you get through cheats, and I could go on and on. The bottom line is, IT'S FREAKIN FUN!!!
For the sake of realism and in effort to be true to the Bond character by sacrificeing fun you need not look further than Goldenwii Reloaded. Where you can only carry three weapons, can't dual wield, and pistols might as well shoot corks when against an automatic. They really know how to suck the fun out of things don't they.
I sometimes wish I could just sound the alarm on myself and go hide in a corner as the special forces pour in matrix style like I did so many times in Facility and Bunker. Games don't let you do that anymore. I hate grenades.
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Post by multigamejunkie on Nov 28, 2014 23:16:46 GMT -5
Never played dark souls however I did play the original demon's souls and to be honest it was fun at first but got tedious and boring after a while not to say it was to hard for me it just not my cup of tea I enjoy a more laid back RPG like morrowind where I just sit back and relax and create my own adventure y immersing myself and that world and being my character for a while so its roleplaying to a certain extent
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Post by JMMREVIEW on Dec 1, 2014 11:08:36 GMT -5
I just sit back and relax and create my own adventure y immersing myself and that world and being my character for a while so its roleplaying to a certain extent I can see what you are saying, there ARE different ways of completing Dark Souls but it IS, or at least it feels like a liner game. The big difference is I play Dark Souls for the challenge what you have describe with games like morrowind, and I would add Fallout 3 they are fun but not difficult. It is a different experience.
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